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Cavalry Question
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TOPIC: Cavalry Question

Cavalry Question 11 months, 3 weeks ago #1

  • Dutch101
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Hello, I was hoping to gain some knowledge here being relatively new to Waterloo (not Gettysburg however). I have experienced some very wide results in cavalry vs cavalry melee and was looking for either observations or perhaps the technical knowledge of whats going on under the hood in these calculations. For example, a recent melee saw two squadrons of french lancers charge the flank or a brunswick hussar squadron which was pursuing a third french cavalry unit. I expected the lancers to do great damage but lost 182-0 when striking the enemy from 90 degrees directly in their flank. Given this and other results, what is the best way to employ cavalry against other cavalry? Can anyone shed light on exactly what calculations are actually made for these engagements? Thank you.
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Re: Cavalry Question 11 months, 2 weeks ago #2

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This happens all the time with cavalry vs cavalry melee despite claims of it being fixed over a year ago.
Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 11 months, 2 weeks ago #3

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Oh? The patches didn't fix this? I thought it had been dealt with long ago as well.
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Re: Cavalry Question 11 months, 2 weeks ago #4

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Ah I did not realize there was a known issue with this, I figured I had done something incorrectly or missed a detail perhaps. This happened to me in a multiplayer game two days ago so I'm afraid this seems to be an ongoing anomaly. I'm relieved in a way it doesn't seem to be my fault, my pride as a cavalry commander was in serious jeopardy for a while there

Re: Cavalry Question 11 months, 2 weeks ago #5

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Have you got the latest patch installed? It was issued at the same time as the Quatre Bras DLC.
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Re: Cavalry Question 11 months, 2 weeks ago #6

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Yes my game is current unless the patch wasn't released for steam users. I have both DLC as well, I purchased the game at the same time as the DLC so my assumption is that the patch would have been included at that point.

Re: Cavalry Question 11 months, 2 weeks ago #7

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Saddletank wrote:
Oh? The patches didn't fix this? I thought it had been dealt with long ago as well.



So did I when I saw no new reports of it since we released the fix over a year or more ago.

OP - if you use steam then you're patched. If this is a rare occurrence then melee in the game has a margin of random, so an extreme result is possible. If this is something that happens regularly then please send a save in to This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it for us to look at, with all mods off - thanks.

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 3 weeks ago #8

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I decided to give Waterloo another go so I played the LG04 - The Eagle Triumphs (F-Army) scenario. Everything was going well with the French Army until the French Cavalry got involved, if they can manage to catch any retreating\routing infantry they can inflicted some serious damage but when it comes to Cavalry vs Cavalry melee they are next to useless.

Here's another example of a one sided melee where the French Cavalry get slaughtered without inflicting any casualties to the enemy, this happens so often you don't really need a save file to see it just fight any battle with cavalry in it but I still sent you a saved game file.



Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 2 weeks ago #9

This happens all the time to me as well. I love the game but this should be looked at.

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #10

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Some more examples.






Something is wrong with the Carabiniers they are useless, they always suffer very heavy casualties.
Leicestershire
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #11

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Some more.



Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #12

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I think you need to send NSD savegames to show this is happening, not screenshots.
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #13

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I have.
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #14

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Are you using any mods? these may affect the game. If so repeat without the mods.

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #15

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gunship24 wrote:
Are you using any mods? these may affect the game. If so repeat without the mods.


Yes I am.

18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Packed Terrain Sprites
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Slower_Animations
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Custom-Sandbox
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Realistic Smoke light version
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\ShrapnelEx
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Foot Guards
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Ch a Ch Garde and Pr Landwehr Cav
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Full_French_Campaign
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\BloodBath Waterloo
18:13:21 Mod: D:\STEAM\STEAMAPPS\COMMON\SCOURGE OF WAR WATERLOO\Mods\Expanded Toolbar V - Grog

I'll try again without any mods.
Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #16

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Saddletank look away now,

Some more with only the Expanded Toolbar V - Grog mod & I sent you a save as well.




Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #17

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Try it without the Grog toolbar next. It might even be that.
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #18

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Saddletank wrote:
Try it without the Grog toolbar next. It might even be that.


The thought of playing the game without the toolbar makes me shudder, it just ain't going to happen.
Leicestershire
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #19

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roy64 wrote:

The thought of playing the game without the toolbar makes me shudder, it just ain't going to happen.


Same here. I would sooner see my cavalry slaughtered to a man than not use the grog toolbar.
"One crowded hour of glorious life is worth an age without a name" - The Call by Thomas Mordaunt
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #20

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But with any mod switched on NSD won't even look at the issue. Been there, got the t-shirt.

Basically if you're playing with ANY mod and seeing weird behaviour - you just have to 1) suck it up or 2) present the problem to the mod author and not NSD.

BTW, for the purposes of TESTING to see if the problem still happens its worth it, yes? I'm not suggesting you play the game w/o the toolbar for ever, just that you test play long enough to see if the problem happens or not for the purpose of sending NSD a savegame.
HITS & Couriers - a different and realistic way to play SoW MP.

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #21

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Saddletank wrote:
But with any mod switched on NSD won't even look at the issue. Been there, got the t-shirt.

Basically if you're playing with ANY mod and seeing weird behaviour - you just have to 1) suck it up or 2) present the problem to the mod author and not NSD.

BTW, for the purposes of TESTING to see if the problem still happens its worth it, yes? I'm not suggesting you play the game w/o the toolbar for ever, just that you test play long enough to see if the problem happens or not for the purpose of sending NSD a savegame.


Well if that's the case NSD have a serious problem with their customer support. They claimed they had fixed this problem a long time ago which obviously they haven't.

The toolbar comes with the game & I think it's safe to say that everyone who plays this game uses the toolbar so it would be in their interest to solve this game breaking bug.

This thread was started over 4 months ago & there's been very little response or interest from NSD which makes them look lazy or uninterested in the problem, in fact you've been more help.
Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #22

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Saddletank wrote:
But with any mod switched on NSD won't even look at the issue. Been there, got the t-shirt.


That's strange, when I first reported this over one & a half years ago they never even mentioned anything about whether I was using any mods or not, so they must have been having you on. All they said was "I've logged the issue and we'll look into it - thanks for the report."
Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #23

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Right I took the plunge with no toolbar & had the same results as I expected. I have sent a save but I have no idea if NSD gets them as the never respond.



Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #24

I have always experienced this, even before I started using the grog toolbar. I have also tried it without toolbar a few months ago. Same result. I just thought the French Cav were bad. It does seem to happen much more frequently with French light cav rather than heavy. Still, even with light cav, the results should not be 50 killed with no casualties inflicted, especially when the enemy cav is outnumbered or in some cases appear to be blown.

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #25

Does this happen to anyone playing Brits and Prussians? Is it just the French who suffer this? I will try the Brit cav and see if the French cav are better when the AI is running things.

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #26

So I tried being the Prussians and attacked with Prussian Landwehr cav against French Chasseurs and the Prussians had a reasonable result. No 0 to 50 casualties. Then I switched back to French and tried French Hussars against Prussian Hussars. One Prussian Hussar regiment defeated 3 fresh French regiments in succession, inflicting 75 to 80 casualties on each French regiment while losing 0 to 2 against each and capturing each French regiment. This makes no sense! I think I have had enough of this game. Too bad because other than this I really think it is a great game!
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #27

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Capt Saucier wrote:
So I tried being the Prussians and attacked with Prussian Landwehr cav against French Chasseurs and the Prussians had a reasonable result. No 0 to 50 casualties. Then I switched back to French and tried French Hussars against Prussian Hussars. One Prussian Hussar regiment defeated 3 fresh French regiments in succession, inflicting 75 to 80 casualties on each French regiment while losing 0 to 2 against each and capturing each French regiment. This makes no sense! I think I have had enough of this game. Too bad because other than this I really think it is a great game!



I dread to think how long it will take for a fix for this considering how long it's taken for the campaign to be fixed. Oh I forgot it hasn't
Leicestershire

Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #28

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I wanted to get in on this and see if I could figure out why its happening, so I started playing LG-04 The eagle triumphs also since it seems to be the testing ground. Im about 3 and a half hours into the battle and Ive been unable to replicate this. And its not for lack of trying. Ive charged my cavalry at every Prussian cavalry unit that comes realistically close enough and in almost all cases my cavalry kicked the crap out of them. Most of this has been on the left side of the field around St. Armand La Haye and Wagnalee. After I captured Wagnalee I sent two cavalry brigades north to occupy the Namur road objective(since that's big money)

The Prussians are pretty much completely defeated from St Armand to Wagnalee and today Il start on the Ligny side of things where I have a lot more cavalry and hopefully I can get this to happen. But yea, no luck so far. So far my cavalry's been kicking ass. In some cases Ive had to restrain their enthusiasm for running down the enemy.

I am using the newest grog toolbar as well.
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #29

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I wonder if its something going wrong in individual installs? It sounds like it if one player sees it and another does not. I would guess a full uninstall and reinstall is the only way to see, including deleting and redownloading all mods.

If it helps this feature is not present in the KS Mod and with a lot of recent work on the ai.dll file in the KS Mod the game plays very differently now: cavalry acts in a completely different manner to stock cavalry, even making logical choices over targets.
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Re: Cavalry Question 7 months, 1 week ago #30

I tried another test, this time as 3 Prussian Hussars vs 3 French Hussars. 3 Prussian regiments suffered 210 casualties to 6 with 2 of the 3 Prussian regiments being captured as well. Interestingly this sandbox scenario had multiple corps involved even though I chose to fight corps vs corps. I could only control one Prussian corps. The rest were AI controlled. This is using a sandbox battle.

I am using 1.01 and the version of Grog V that was updated last July or August. I have not upgraded to Wavre and latest patch, as I read there may be some problems with the patch. I will next try the same Ligny scenario to see if this occurs. Could it just be the sandbox?
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