Antietam Terrain Mod

Jolly wrote: So, is there a chance of making a working ANT_1.CSV file for this?

Not directly. As DaV has pointed out, the same greyscale numbers are used by the two maps for two different terrain types, so you'd need to make sure your bmp greyscale number fits the terrain type YOU want, then go thru the CVEAST.csv and ANT1.csv comparing them and making every entry correct as you want them.

Not a big task as there are not that many entries - maybe 50?

Jolly wrote: The Terrain_Effects.dds is from the Chickamauga mod

This is your problem, the smoke graphic on the Chickamauga dds is probably at a different X-Y address on the texture sheet to the same graphic on the ANT1 dds. Check the Chickamauga.csv (presumably pulling the smoke graphic from Chickamauga.dds) and find the entry that plants the smoke graphic on that map, then transfer that file location to your ANT1.csv.

"Jolly" - I would concentrate on the "mapname.csv" that matches the "mapname.bmp" file. That way you know that the GreyScale colors are matching.

To get the exact coordinates for the fire :

Start Game - March a unit to the exact spot of the fire :

Press the "L" button :

Exit - Game :

Go to the Work Folder and look for a file called "StartLocs"

Now, find the unit that you marched to that exact spot - Their coordinates will be shown in the StartLocs file.

davinci

Thanks again for your invaluable advice Saddletank and DaV.

I decided originally on using the CV etc files/templates, thinking that it would be relativly easy to adjust the csv's after doing the new graphics.

Not so easy after all!!

I'll keep you informed!

Cheers

David

Jolly wrote: I decided originally on using the CV etc files/templates, thinking that it would be relativly easy to adjust the csv's after doing the new graphics.

Not so easy after all!!

Hmm, unless I'm missing something!

"Jolly" - Why can't you open both ( csv ) files at the same time and just Copy what you have done with the (CV) csv to that of the (Ant1) csv.

This way, you will start at the top of the file and "Match" each "GreyScale" as you go down the page.

You know this but I'll just type it anyway, the game doesn't care if you use the (CV) Graphics, or the (Ant) Graphics - as long as you define them correctly, and place them in the correct folder.

Also - You haven't changed the "mapname.bmp" file, correct?

So, you shouldn't have any un-defined-greyscale-colors.

davinci

Where does the GFXPACK.CSV fit into things? That seems to me to contain the info for the terrain dds files, which includes the smoke graphics.

I'm using three terrain dds files - terrain_effects.dds (from Chickamauga), cv1.dds and cv2.dds, along with a renamed Ant_1.csv file.

It does look good, apart from the anomalies with the trees/fire.
Also the trees are either full on or full off when hitting the 'T' in game.

I've not changed the map bmp.

There is not THAT much wrong, but enough to be a show stopper at the moment.

David

Jolly wrote: Where does the GFXPACK.CSV fit into things? That seems to me to contain the info for the terrain dds files, which includes the smoke graphics.

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Graphics Folder - can contain the following:

Packed - folder - any terrain file that is in the new packed format, this is the DDS file and the PList file...an example would be the "Terrain_Effects.dds" and the "Terrain_Effects.plist"

Terrain - folder - any Graphic file such as a tree or bush or wheat that is "Not" in the new packed format. you can use both packed and non-packed graphics on the map together.
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Logistics - folder - gfxpack.csv - goes here.
Now - if some of the graphics are not packed - ( gfx.csv ) will also go inside of this folder.

Jolly wrote: I'm using three terrain dds files - terrain_effects.dds (from Chickamauga), cv1.dds and cv2.dds, along with a renamed Ant_1.csv file.

That is do-able!

Get the names of the various trees...etc - from the "gfxpack.csv" file and "Place" that name in the "mapname.csv" file.

To put that another way - the "gfxpack" should contain all of the files from those three files - to be used in the "Ant_1.csv" file.

Jolly wrote: It does look good, apart from the anomalies with the trees/fire.

Standby - on this one!
Also - did you try to get the coordinates from the previous file as "Saddletank" mentioned?

Jolly wrote: Also the trees are either full on or full off when hitting the 'T' in game.

Check the [J \ K \ L] Columns in the "mapname.csv" file - I think that one of those controls the toggle of the trees.

Jolly wrote: I've not changed the map bmp.

OK, so the only greyscale colors' used are already defined correctly.

davinci

In "mapname.csv" column J is headed "no thin". I have never personally changed the value in here but you could try inserting a "1" for your woods greyscale value where you are having trees bleed over onto the roads. Without a thinning switch on at the edge this may made the woods boundary more solid and fix your trees-in-the-roads problem. However, as I said, I have never tried it though.

Column K is the "fade" column and leaving this blank allows the sprites to fade out near the player in HITS view. Highly recommended to leave this blank for trees and tall vegetation. If you put a "1" here they do not fade as the player camera gets close which makes fighting in woods and tall corn really damn difficult in HITS mode!

Column L is the toggle control for when the player cycles through the "T" key. Insert 1, 2, or 3 values in here to control the steps at which the vegetation can be toggled off. The way these files work can be really subtle - so if you have two greyscales to represent "light woods" for example, you can give the two lines identical values (though maybe calling on two different sets of tree sprites to add variation) but different toggle values so hitting the "T" key once would thin out the woods by the proportion of that greyscale vs the other as used in the greyscale.bmp map and hitting it a second time (or even a third time if you mix together three different greyscales) would remove them all. The way the bmp and csv files mesh and work together has impressed me no end since I began to dabble in map work.

I use the "L" column trick in my map because I play HITS but for a hi-level camera this subtlety is perhaps not needed.

Got the flames working - yey !!




I copied the 'Terrain Table Sounds' entries from the orig Ant_1.csv file, and hey presto - flames in the correct position!
So simple, but I'd just presumed they were for the sound effects.

On to the maybe not so simple trees now!

Thanks so much for all the help guys.

David

Jolly wrote: I copied the 'Terrain Table Sounds' entries from the orig Ant_1.csv file, and hey presto - flames in the correct position!
So simple, but I'd just presumed they were for the sound effects.

"Jolly" Check what it says at the top of Column [ E ].

Also - verify that None of those trees listed below that are the ones that are causing you a problem.

I wouldn't think so since they are assigned to a certain coordinate from the original map.
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EDIT Post - Jolly - did you notice this error at the bottom of your last post? Never seen that before!

Warning: Creating default object from empty value in /home/robtim3/norbsoftdev.net/components/com_kunena/lib/kunena.parser.bbcode.php on line 209

davinci

I see it, yes.

What the hell is that?

Not Sure - But check this post from several years ago.

www.norbsoftdev.net/forum/scenario-editor/70475-exe-wont-run

davinci

It could be something to do with the site hosts?

Things are progressing though, got the T values looking ok, and progress with the trees.

David

Rounding things up now ...





Getting really close!

David(jolly)

Looking good. We need someone to redo the zig-zag fencing texture though - the alpha channel layer isn't quite right.

Yep, the alpha is slighty overlapping the texture, same for the spiky fences.

Not to hard to fix if you can access/extract the 3d texture mapping graphics files.
Textures for the buildings etc could be tweaked also.

The technical side is slowing things down with a few annoying problems - still getting some trees on roads, but also I have to disable the Chickamauga and Chancellorsville mods, otherwise they override the 'terrain' dds files in this Ant mod, even though they are less prioritised in order.

Bugles & Flags works fine.

Jolly wrote: Still getting some trees on roads.

"Jolly" - One way to figure out which line is causing the tree problem is to "Copy" the "mapname.csv" to the Desktop.
Then - Delete all of the tree entries in the "mapname.csv" file. Only Columns [ M -thru- Q ].
Start Game - check to make sure that no trees are in the road area. Exit Game.

Open the "mapname.csv" from the Desktop - Copy a "Whole Line" that has the trees - Columns [ M -thru- Q ] - "CLOSE" that file, and Open the "mapname.csv" in the Maps \ Folder - Copy - but only place them on "ONE" line.

Start Game - Check Roads.

You are probably going to have to repeat this until you figure out which line is causing the problem.

It's a slow process, but it works.
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EDIT Post - Actually, there might be another way that is very simple.
Edit the "mapname.csv" file to only use the same trees on each of the tree entries.

In this example you are only going to use "Four" different trees to help identify which line is causing the problem.

Also - delete the trees from the Marsh, Riverbank, and Open - until the problem is solved.

IDS_MAP_Light_Woods - Use a Single tree for all entries - Columns [ M - thru - Q ]
IDS_MAP_Light_Woods - Use a Single tree for all entries - Columns [ M - thru - Q ]
IDS_MAP_Woods - Use a Single tree for all entries - Columns [ M - thru - Q ]
IDS_MAP_Heavy_Woods - Use a Single tree for all entries - Columns [ M - thru - Q ]

You are probably going to have to repeat starting the game multiple times, since the game loads the tree graphics in a different location each time.

davinci

Thanks Davinci. I know what you are getting at here.
Problem is that this would reduce the amount of trees/bushes in the map, therefore reducing the percentage amount of them appearing on the roads. Also it looses some of the ambience over the map.

I need to keep the trees etc, but find a way of keeping them off the roads (alongside looks fine)!

David(jolly)

Jolly wrote: I need to keep the trees etc, but find a way of keeping them off the roads (alongside looks fine)!

Understood!
The only other way that I know of would be to "Edit" the "mapname.bmp" file and either create a wider shoulder on the road-system, or edit all of the trees near the road.

Editing all of the trees on a large map is quite time-consuming considering that most of the newer maps use multiple greyscale colors per woods.

Question - Did the Original Map suffer the same problem?

If the answer is "Yes" - OK.
If the answer is "No" - then what did you do that is different, or causing the problem.

davinci

J

Sorry if suggesting what you already know, and am happy to take a look if you wish. Just pm me a DL link.

Roads and tracks usually have 2 greyscale values. Check the mapname.csv to make sure you haven't accidentally applied tree sprites to one of these when copying over the Chancellorsville entries.

If it's more to do with your new trees being bigger and therefore encroaching on the roads, then say and I'll suggest some potential fixes.

The tree are always erratic each time you load the same senario, so you never know what you will get, as in this pic -




just need them off the bloody roads!

I'll try the 'mapname.bmp' approach that you mention Davinci and see what happens!

The original Ant maps are fine for this. They use different files, which is why I'm getting problems now of course, after originally deciding to work with the Chancellorsville DDS terrain sheets and the latest Terrain_Effects.dds sheet.

I did try editing and removing some trees from the csv Crikey, but I got some anomiles (sprites suddenly disappearing/appearing), plus the map was looking more sparce, lacking the extra trees/shrubs.

I don't think its anything to do with the tree scale (bigger).

Another real annoyance is that the Chickamauga and Chancellorsville DDS graphics override this mod, no matter that they are below in the prority list.
I can't figure out any reason for this to happen, but it does.

Thanks for your continued advice and suggestions guys.

David(jolly)

Jolly wrote: The tree are always erratic each time you load the same scenario, so you never know what you will get.

True, there seems to be a 2 pixel wide area that a tree might appear when it shouldn't.

Jolly wrote: I'll try the 'mapname.bmp' approach that you mention Davinci and see what happens!

You are way better using Photoshop than I am, but basically use Photoshop to create a 2 pixel buffer or shoulder on the outside roads. This will Stop 99% of the trees from entering that zone.

Jolly wrote: They use different files, which is why I'm getting problems now of course, after originally deciding to work with the Chancellorsville DDS terrain sheets and the latest Terrain_Effects.dds sheet.

Another real annoyance is that the Chickamauga and Chancellorsville DDS graphics override this mod, no matter that they are below in the priority list.
I can't figure out any reason for this to happen, but it does.

Yes, You mentioned this earlier but I forgot to respond to it.
It is Possible that the Game is "Coded" to only use "One" of those files at a time.

You can use all three, but you should change the names of two of them.

To put that another way, only use "One" "Terrain_Effects" sheet.

The other ones could be "Terrain_Effects2" and "Terrain_Effects3".

That will require that you change the names of all of the entries in both of them.

But, I'm just guessing at that, Not Sure!

davinci

It looks nice, things will be fixed, it'll get there!

You beat my post Davinci - more great insights from you!

Yep, another pretty picture!
Some interesting results with the RGB's inside the LSL file.



Getting some nice blendings for the fields and the road edges.

Here's the original map for some comparison ...




David(jolly)

Artillery and flags looking good!

Set well in the environment.

Looks wonderful! I hope it comes out soon.