Tests on 1.1b

[GShock]

I just wanted to write down the things I've noticed about this release so as to build (eventually and by no mean as mandatory) possible improvements for the near or late future of this wonderful game.

My tests are taking place on the Bde tutorial on Grognard level and after 4 consecutive battles (all lost) here's what I noticed:

There seems to be an unbalance between the CSA and USA forces. While the OOB shows a numerical advantage of 2000 men for CSA, the USA has got some artillery. The battle is supposed to be a BDE sized one but it looks like it's more of a Corps vs Corps where the player controls a single BDE of 5 Rgts. The beginning of the battle sees the USA player with mere 2 Rgts facing Archer's Bde. Thanks to the reinforcing 3 RGts and the defensive position, it is relatively easy to rout the 13th Al and even capture the 5th Al. This though leaves the player with his best RGT (seasoned) crippled with losses and quite tired.

My concern at this stage is since the setting is Courier SIDE for this difficulty level, the total lacking of indicators either on the map or on the command map make it difficult to really assess where exactly a RGT is and where exactly it is to be moved. I fail to see the destination of a map-commanded move for the selected Rgt and there's no indicator for Strat Orders either.

Since the situation is quite tense, the player is advised to engage CSA by the bridge taking advantage of the fences and stonewalls by the woods. Problem: The newly coming RGts for USA are cut off from Cutler, therefore, it may be quite nasty to give any order at all to the newcomers since CSA pinches and kills lots of couriers. This is good... of course.

The latest and final result was a catastrophe for USA but this is quite evidently depending on the fact Gen. Wadsworth does NOT intervene in battle. Asking for support to my DIV commander and CORPS commander was to no avail. In all 4 tests the AI friendly troops only engaged once. In all tests the USA ART was 99% ineffective and ended up as routed but, differently from other versions it did kill something and it definitely wasn't by cannister.

I am afraid unless the AI friends are more cooperative, this is a bde vs Corps battle and that's why it's so unbalanced. The Courier pathing might be a possible reason for the friends' inactivity, though it's really impossible to know at this difficulty level because of camera restrictions. As a sidenote this battle, like all others, evolves in a different way every time the player takes a different tactical choice. If the CSA comes full on you there's no chance to even hold for 10 minutes without help... and that's where the main problem is.

I was surprised to see the 13th AL taking so much punishment... being shot at by 4 different RGTs it took about 10 minutes of game time to make it rout but you can tell by its size that it is a huge RGT and Archer did have the skill of bolstering his troops' morale. I don't know about Davis but I saw him trouncing our entire DIV (me included) three times in a row. That DIV in the last test was camped for the entire battle and got surrounded on all sides and routed piece by piece.

I do think something's gotta have to do with my skills with the game (do mind it's quite tricky at Grognard Level) but it really feels VERY unbalanced the way it is.

In the one battle where my DIV actually fought, the match lasted for long and it was much much better. Things being what they are I would like to test this over and over again *with* the help of your comments on how EXACTLY to make my AI friendly troops intervene (i.e. how to send a courier to effectively tell them to stop camping and come helping my single BDE which is fighting against an entire CSA division).

Should this be solved, this scenario would really and I mean REALLY be a very credible introduction to the complexity of this game. So are there problems with the AI and Grognard Level? How do you make your AI troops commmit to help Cutler's troops? Is there a specific way to use the Courier for help in this Tutorial?
How is the "destination" in the command map supposed to look? Is it correct that basically only the objectives and the player's PoV show (Grognard Level) ?

Be advised: At this stage it is nearly impossible to effectively TC individual RGTs. This means switching to column and double stepping to flank an enemy RGT is impossible and this is a big loss. The sending of the same order again to a unit that just switched to line and engaged, ignoring such order, is a waste of time; remember: At this stage, everything is done by couriering. A possible quick solution in this direction would come handy.

Thanks for your tips and shared observations.

[Little Powell]

The Grog level is supposed to be very unbalanced with the AI having a huge advantage. That combined with no map icons, HITS etc., it's supposed to be near impossible to even win the brigade tutorial.

I have found the best way to get the right difficulty level is to change the custom difficulty settings. Mess around with the enemy strength, camera level, map icons and find what's right for you.

[Marching Thru Georgia]

GShock wrote:

Is there a specific way to use the Courier for help in this Tutorial?

Norb fixed the non-response of friendly units in an earlier test version. They would now respond to cries for help if you were engaged and they were not. I even had a division comander send me a brigade while he was mopping up a few broken enemy regiments. Something may have been broken again in the meantime. It may also be the case that the tutorial is so heavily scripted, that the friendlies never have a chance to respond. The script might be overriding your request. Try asking for help in a sandbox game.

In all tests the USA ART was 99% ineffective and ended up as routed but, differently from other versions it did kill something and it definitely wasn't by cannister.

I too noticed a reduction of effectiveness of the arty in this release.

[Little Powell]

"I too noticed a reduction of effectiveness of the arty in this release."

The effectiveness of arty should be increased in this release, not decreased. I did quite a bit of testing on it (and also observing in our MP games) that arty both US and CS cause way more damage than they used to. We were playing an MP game the other night. I had a battery setup at least 800 yards away from the enemy and it racked up close to 100 points in about 15 minutes..

[norb]

There's just no way it's reduced in effectiveness. But when the SDK is finalized and released you can pump it up all you want. We spent a lot of time on arty this release, taking a lot of input from the forums. But there's always a gameplay balance and we make sure that no one unit type can dominate the battlefield and they all work together.

[KG_Soldier]

In the mp games we've played since the release of the patch, no doubt the arty is a lot stronger. And it seems as if they are more resistant to musket fire as well.

[Turbotay]

I wouldn't say they are more resistant to small arms fire. Last night I scattered at least 4 guns with a single regiment. Maybe your boys need to go back to the range, Soldier...


--
Robinson

[Little Powell]

In the mp games we've played since the relase of the patch, no doubt the arty is a lot stronger. And it seems as if they are more resistant to musket fire as well.

Have you noticed batteries are a lot smarter when it comes to avoiding capture? Another one of my favorite new features..

Norb spent quite a bit of time on that. When he first made an adjustment, arty would literally limber up and head for the hills when a regiment got anywhere close to them. Then we found a happy medium where they can still be captured, but you really have to be vigilant to pull it off.

[Garnier]

We don't use AI in MP.

But arty will definitely be easier to capture now with the withdraw by recoil fix. Because before, at least against people like me who used the exploit, it was simply impossible.

[GShock]

So here we go, 3 more tests.

We have a semi-serious interface UI problem with the difficulty levels and what is being displayed on the map along with other things.

To make the statement clear, it looks like the first thing to be selected is the difficulty level and, afterwards, you can select custom and override the difficulty chosen. While this is good, as you set for example grognard, you have no visualization of the AI aids because the values don't change. Similarly (and it's EXACTLY the point of my very first statement as thread starter) if you select the "Show all in sight" (map icons) and then hit grognard (or historical) the menu will STILL list the "Show all in sight" but once you are in the game, of course, you don't see a damn.

So it's an UI problem... I think it's better and less confusing if according to the difficulty you choose the menu CHANGES to show the limits (another limit that changes but is not visualized is the Courier Level which is the hardest and most challenging part of the high difficulty games).

As of the N it works like a charm provided you can see the units on the map. Here it would be very user friendly to actually have the mouse wheel zoom in and out so you can pinpoint the exact location where you want to send the selected unit but what matters the most is that Strat/Main Obj, selected unit and destination point be visible whatever the difficulty level chosen.

Unfortunately, things being what they are, we have a feature (the difficulty) which hampers with another feature (the command map). I think the compromise I named could be an effective way to keep both in place, though after seeing the LOVELY battles that just unravelled in this tutorial with HISTORICAL (and then hit the custom to finetune the couriering and map icons) setting I can tell Wadsworth was VERY helpful and we obtained a colossal victory (Possibly with Grognard Level the CSA is buffed up while USA AI isn't since it's on the player's side and Wadsworth would not engage knowing he would lose? Don't know).

As of the ARTy I didn't get close enough to see how it's working now because victory was achieved when my BDE pinned Davis by the crossing. Me on a side, Wadsworth on the other. Our Arty scored 130, quite a difference with what it used to be.

Couriering is working like a charm now, if I may say something about "pathing" I think the AI generals were honestly almost in touch with my infantry. I think the AI doesn't need to be handicapped further (but if you play with restricted camera and max couriering you are severely handicapped trust me!) so I'd devise some way to keep the AI generals BEHIND the units whose morale they want to bolster and PATH safe ways to reach that "behind".

It does ruin the atmosphere to have an enemy 2-star general about 20 yds away from 500 of your men and none of them taking a shot. We know officers were top targets during the civil war. If the couriers were so much improved so could (and should) be the generals.

The game changed dramatically for the better and in these 2 last tests on the BDE tutorial I started wondering what the real levels of the AI become when you select the different difficulty options. Again, I think they should come written in the menu (and then you can customize them but what can you customize if you don't know what each level means?). One thing I would have expected to change were the fatigue levels coming after a charge but I did notice that once your energy is spent it takes quite some time to recover and that's very good. On the other hand it looks like some of the CSA units could take a long time punishment... even when shot at from front + both sides (1 vs 3) it stood for quite some time but it was a fresh CSA vs 3 battered and quite tired USA RGTs so it was a fair behavior (they did rout in the end).

Hell of a game, GJ guys. Will perform some more tests overnight.