Napoleonic Wars mod

[Jack ONeill]

Nowy,

I agree with my learned Comrade Born2See. Unless you have played the game, don't knock it. This engine is arguably the finest combat-sim engine on the planet. That includes Les Grognards and any of the TW series, ALL of which I have played extensively. No engine is perfect, but this one is truly outstanding. So, either man-up, get the game, get your ass beat a few times BY THE AWESOME AI, then get slapped a few times by some of us human players in MP, or pipe down. See you on the Battlefield...

Sic Semper Fidelis

Jack "marching to the sound of the Guns" O'Neill B)

[Jack ONeill]

Oh yeah,

Gunship - REALLY looking forward to this mod.

Jack B)

[Nowy]

Nowy,

I agree with my learned Comrade Born2See. Unless you have played the game, don't knock it. This engine is arguably the finest combat-sim engine on the planet. That includes Les Grognards and any of the TW series, ALL of which I have played extensively. No engine is perfect, but this one is truly outstanding. So, either man-up, get the game, get your ass beat a few times BY THE AWESOME AI, then get slapped a few times by some of us human players in MP, or pipe down. See you on the Battlefield...

Sic Semper Fidelis

Jack "marching to the sound of the Guns" O'Neill B)

Maybe it was my fault, but I did not play demo.
I was afraid that my old laptop could be too weak and my better computer still was occupied.

What is more, I was not so interested in American Civil War, however I am very, very interested in Napoleonic Wars.

I also had not a lot of time to play all these games, especially when they were not based on period which I’d like to play or had many other problems.

If SoWG engine could handle well Napoleonic warfare and there will be prepared good mod basing on Napoleonic era then I will download it immediately.

I’d like to clarify that I was not intent to knock this game. Only put my short remarks here because this NW mod looks interesting. However I have got some doubts there.

Will SoWG engine and other needed things good enough for such large development as this interesting mod?

Is it possible to implement there so complex Napoleonic warfare and tons of quite different units, formations and many, many other things?

Nowy

[Jack ONeill]

N,

Dude, just download the demo and give it a run. Free is free. Feel the power of this awesome game. The SOW engine will be able to handle any Horse and Musket Mod developed. Yes, there will need to be allowances for some small stuff like 3-rank formations vs. 2-rank ones, the odd Square situation, etc. but, there was a Napoleanics mod for TC2M which worked fairly well as I recall.

Just a note - there was either a Total War Napleanics game or maybe it was a mod, I don't remember. Surprised you haven't played it. (It was really weak, actually.)

Also, remember too, the American Civil War was kind of the last Napoleanic style wars. Most of the Generals were schooled in the Napoleanic style of fighting, until horribly disabused by the heavy casualties those tactics produced.

Jack "Wandering aimlessly about the Battlefield, giving bad advice..." O'Neill B)

[gunship24]

SoWG is an awesome game and the only game I have come across that allow you to play battles as they were meant to be played. These arent quick 20min affairs but can take hours to take ground. This mod will be for those that want a fun mod, but will have restrictions so if its a die-hard napoleonic game you are after then there are alternatives. My interest is also more in napoleonic but that doesnt stop me from enjoying the Civil war games.

Update
My mod focuses on the way between Austria and France 1807-1809 the same campaign that ended with the battle of Wagram. I have sprites for the following:

Austria:
Infantry wearing helmet
Infantry wearing shako
Grenadiers in bearskins
Jager
Grenzer
Mounted officers
Dragoons on horseback
Foot Artillery including drivers

France:
Infantry ligne
Infantry legere
Old Guard
Voltigeurs
Mounted officers
Chasseurs a Cheval
Foot Artillery including drivers

There are new flags and connon effects. I have also created basic unit icons so the only flags you see are for regiments and not generals or artillery so it looks more historic.

Going well. Artillery done, cavalry done. Sprites done. I am editing formations as I want to have the attack column and 3-rank for the french. Order of battles are slightly different to the SoWG ones because some battalions have over 1000 men in them. I wanted to keep the 1:4 ratio so have split any large battlions in two. I will determine if that is still ok but am going down that route for now.

[born2see]

f rgiv me but I'v be n dro ling on my k ybo rd. I' s not wor ing so wel.

B

[Jack ONeill]

Right you are, Born.

Gunship - remember, the only major power using a two rank formation was the British. The French actually shifted, (or tried to), in 1813 (1814?), but everyone else still used it.

Attack column - Column d' Division d' Battalion or Column d' Battalion d' Division? OR L'Order Mixre? (Yes, these ARE real French formations.)

Inquiring Loons want to know.

Jack "completely confused by PTSD" O'Neill B)

[gunship24]

Thanks Jack. Im keeping it simple for the time being. 'Attack column' as i call it is bascially an altered column of divisions from the stock game, 2 companies by 3 deep. I havent tried Grande Masse yet for the Austrians. I was experimenting with the MeleeMod and FireMod in drills but cant see any change using them so it will be a shame if they dont work.

[Nowy]

Also, remember too, the American Civil War was kind of the last Napoleonic style wars. Most of the Generals were schooled in the Napoleanic style of fighting, until horribly disabused by the heavy casualties those tactics produced.

Yes and NOT.
Yes, because ACW was kind of musket and sword style warfare in few things similar to Napoloenic style wars.

NOT, because ACW was c.a. 50 years later and it was quite different in many cases than NW.

During NW such things were characteristic:
- different national units organisation, where infantry and cavalry regiments included different numbers of battalions or squadrons and different numbers of companies and men strength
- more colourful uniforms and their facings, big variety of head wears and uniforms styles
- important role of elite troops as like grenadiers, voltigeurs, imperial guards
- French modelled battle columns, later also used by coalition forces
- bunch of infantry skirmishers screened own army, sought enemy positions, probed, provoked and weaken enemy units, tried kill officers and artillerymen, supported tight columns attacks etc
- 3-ranks infantry line formation used mainly for fire fights
- few systems of infantry fire which also included volleys delivered in shorter range
- infantry bayonets still played important role and were often attached to muskets
- infantry square formations were used defensively against cavalry
- many different types of cavalry as like carabineers, cuirassiers, heavy dragoons, dragoons, light dragoons, hussars, uhlans, lancers, cheavaulegers, chasseur a cheval, Landwehr, and national cavalry, Cossacks and irregular cavalry
- specialised role heavy, light, line and irregular cavalry
- cavalry had more important role and there were decisive massive cavalry charges
- cavalry used mainly cold steel arms and charged on horseback in melee
- fire arms cavalry used as supportive or individual defence or skirmish weapon
- main cavalry weapon were sabres, swords and lances
- many heavy cavalry units still used body armour and helmets
- solid balls and canisters were common artillery ammunition
- artillery howitzer and shell grenades were less common in use
- modernised ammunition were not so common yet
- more cannons and specific unicorns guns used in Russian artillery batteries
- specific, however very rare in use British rockets
- important role engineering troops as like sappers, miners, pioneers and pontoniers
- siege of permanent fortifications, fortresses and fortified towns required engineers troops
- horse train and no railroads transport
- many other things

These mentioned above things were not or could not be so similar during ACW, and however there still were used muzzle load muskets and artillery guns, as well as sabres and bayonets, it were used sometime differently.

During ACW we can saw that

- artillery shell grenades were more common in use than earlier
- cold steel arms, especially cavalry sabres, swords and lances were not so commonly used in battles
- cavalry was mainly supportive force, which sometime fought dismounted
- infantry more often used 2-ranks line formation
- infantry fire fights begins from longer ranges
- horse wagons as well as railroad transportation
- much less colourful as well less variety of uniforms
- some other specific things

Jack ”Wandering aimlessly about the Battlefield, grooving bad advice…” O’Neill B)

It looks that Jack really was grooving bad advice. B)

Downloaded demo on my old laptop. Started with version 1.1, it works and looks quite well and actually learn tutorials. Personally was not familiar with take command games style (shame on me) and need time to accustom or tame SoWG. But it looks that I am not so clever man or this game is too difficult and not handy in use. Now I am “wandering aimlessly about battlefield” trying lead and command units, and it can makes me nervous sometime.

There exist many glitches and poor things which also James Alllen mentioned in his very good written in Out of Eight review. He found there many strange and bad things, however at last he highly rated this game.

I still got mixed feelings, nevertheless I will try learn little bit more there.

[Nowy]

SoWG is an awesome game and the only game I have come across that allow you to play battles as they were meant to be played. These arent quick 20min affairs but can take hours to take ground. This mod will be for those that want a fun mod, but will have restrictions so if its a die-hard napoleonic game you are after then there are alternatives. My interest is also more in napoleonic but that doesnt stop me from enjoying the Civil war games.

Update
My mod focuses on the way between Austria and France 1807-1809 the same campaign that ended with the battle of Wagram. I have sprites for the following:

Austria:
Infantry wearing helmet
Infantry wearing shako
Grenadiers in bearskins
Jager
Grenzer
Mounted officers
Dragoons on horseback
Foot Artillery including drivers

France:
Infantry ligne
Infantry legere
Old Guard
Voltigeurs
Mounted officers
Chasseurs a Cheval
Foot Artillery including drivers

There are new flags and connon effects. I have also created basic unit icons so the only flags you see are for regiments and not generals or artillery so it looks more historic.

Going well. Artillery done, cavalry done. Sprites done. I am editing formations as I want to have the attack column and 3-rank for the french. Order of battles are slightly different to the SoWG ones because some battalions have over 1000 men in them. I wanted to keep the 1:4 ratio so have split any large battlions in two. I will determine if that is still ok but am going down that route for now.

Well, but what about other important units and things?.

Will you add for example:
- Austrian cuirassiers, chevauleger, uhlans and famous Hungarian hussars
- Austrian Landwehr and volunteer units
- Austrian and Hungarian insurrection units
- French grenadiers, carabineers, cuirassiers, hussars, uhlans, lancers
- French old guard grenadiers or chasseurs, Middle and Young guard Fusileirs or Tirailleurs
- French Imperial Guard cavalry units Horse Grenadier, Polish Chevauleger, Chasseur a cheval, Dragoon, Gendarme, Mamelukes)
- French Imperial guard horse and foot artillery
- French foregin service units (Polish, Swiss, Italians, Portuguese, Croats, Irish and multinational)
- French minor allies units (Polish, Italian, Bavarian, Saxon, Wurtemberg, Westphalian, Baden, Berg and other German)
- French and Austrian engineers, sappers etc.

Yes I know it,s a lot of work, too many different units etc, but how players will play such big and characteristic battles as Aspern-Esling or Wagram without sappers, pontoon bridges and French allies.
It were important and sometime crucial things I suppouse.

You want keep ratio 1:4 while even 1:10 could be not enough, because there were much more men and formations in action even only on one battlefield as Wagram. Good scale and ratio are large problems there.

It is hard implement all needed things.
There are many problems which should be take into account.

Is it possible include at least a trifle these needed things?