Valve says Linux is more viable for games than Windows 8

[Flanyboy]

Hi.

Just poking about with Windows 8, and something not so good occured to me about Steam.

Valve is now telling you the consumer what Operating System they will support meaning if they do decide never to support Windows 8, you gamers out there are shit out of luck. Sure buy Windows 8, but we won't support it, or you... Why don't you try Linux, obviously that OS has a brighter future for gaming than Windows.

Has society become that lazy that they are so willing to put their future in the hands of a company like Valve?

To be fair that is a two way street. Has society become that lazy that they are unwilling to try something new like Linux? Are they too much of a slave to what Microsoft will let them do and what it wont let them do?

If anything this might actually be good for the consumer that Valve is doing this... why you ask? Because developers will support Windows 8, they would be stupid not to, and Valve doesn't make many games they just publish them so Windows 8 will be supported by developers.

If anything though this might push more games to be available on Linux and Mac thus increasing the availability of games on OS' that previously didn't support them thus giving GAMERS a wider selection of OS's that are viable.

Also remember most people end up going with every other OS upgrade. Most gamers never got Vista they went from XP to Windows 7. I think Windows 8 may end up being a transitional OS like Vista was and Windows 9 hopefully will lean more toward desktop and traditional computing because you can only get so much out of ARM architecture.

[Michael Slaunwhite]

Hi.

Just poking about with Windows 8, and something not so good occured to me about Steam.

Valve is now telling you the consumer what Operating System they will support meaning if they do decide never to support Windows 8, you gamers out there are shit out of luck. Sure buy Windows 8, but we won't support it, or you... Why don't you try Linux, obviously that OS has a brighter future for gaming than Windows.

Has society become that lazy that they are so willing to put their future in the hands of a company like Valve?

Has society become that lazy that they are unwilling to try something new like Linux? Are they too much of a slave to what Microsoft will let them do and what it wont let them do?

This is up to the individual to try Linux, MAC or Microsoft, all three are not asking anyone to be a slave to it's operating system. There are two reasons why Linux has really never taken off with the public, and they are, #1: Ease of use, and #2: Amount of quality products for the Linux OS to attract new users to wanting too try, and fall in love with the OS (as I have). Also note that Linux based systems though far more secure, has a nasty way of boxing you in, and not allowing you to do what needs to be done (developers of Linux type OS's decide on what a user can, and cannot do). As far as the MAC is concerned, I have only used it for about 2 months, and decided that what I could do with it is great, the amount of software for it is almost as bad as what you can get for the Linux system, and another very bad corner which is covered in dust, and cobwebs is the fact that the MAC is far too expensive (just another rich mans toy). I could take what it would cost for me to have a really nice MAC system, and build two high-end PC systems with all the top gear.

If anything this might actually be good for the consumer that Valve is doing this... why you ask? Because developers will support Windows 8, they would be stupid not to, and Valve doesn't make many games they just publish them so Windows 8 will be supported by developers. If anything though this might push more games to be available on Linux and Mac thus increasing the availability of games on OS' that previously didn't support them thus giving GAMERS a wider selection of OS's that are viable.

I highly doubt that Valve would be the driving force behind the sudden revolution too push developers into spending more of their resources, and hard earned money to code software for Linux, and the MAC. Mind you I would LOVE to see more games, and software made for the MAC, and Linux, I am all for that, and I for one would be very excited, but it won't be because of any decisions made my Valve, or rants that will bring that about.

Note to Self: Ask Norb to start coding SOWgb, and future releases of their games to be for Linux, and MAC because Valve has spoken the golden word... freedom for all, and more money for them (Valve). For me Valve/Steam are the ticks of the gaming industry no matter the operating system (I affectionately call Valve the little nazi).

Also remember most people end up going with every other OS upgrade. Most gamers never got Vista they went from XP to Windows 7. I think Windows 8 may end up being a transitional OS like Vista was and Windows 9 hopefully will lean more toward desktop and traditional computing because you can only get so much out of ARM architecture.

Your right, not everyone has in the past upgraded between Microsoft OS's, there is no doubt about it. I didn't buy Vista because I was able to test drive it beforehand, and I saw all of it's flaws so I stuck with Windows XP. When Windows 7 came out, and I took that for a test drive, I noticed a few things that made it stand out from Vista, and I knew that it was a more stable, and lasting OS so I bought it.

What Microsoft has done is take the tablet based style/template, and brought it to be a standard for all devices. If anything a person can jump from a Tablet to a PC with absolutely no learning curve with Windows 8, 9, and etc. I personally think that this version of Windows is not a transitional copy such as Vista. Sure it has a whole new look, a pretty good foundation (Windows 7), and many changes that make it one nice flowing operating system which opens many doors for the PC, Tablet, Phone users out there, and ties them all together (let's not forget the XBOX series old, and new).

For me Windows 8 is revolutionary. All other operating systems that Microsoft have not been that way, but Windows 8 has, and again will set a standard in the way we are going to do things. Apple will follow suit (unless they want to have Microsoft do what they did years ago to them, and again take Apple's chances to stay competitive) I hope. This is a critical point, has Apple learned their lesson?

Those who are critical of Windows 8 most likely have never tried it (I'm not looking at you when I say that Flanboy), and really have not taken the time for a real test drive. Believe me, take it for a test drive, and when you are finished putting Windows 8 through it's paces you will come out seeing how incredible it really is. This is the best OS I have seen ever come out of Microsoft, and I was like everyone else here, I started off using MS-DOS (1987).

ARM architecture

I'm not at all familiar with this hardware, so I can't comment on it right now until I do allot more research on it. I'll get back to you on that. :blink:

[Flanyboy]

To be fair a lot of the changes Microsoft has made have been based on what has made Mac so trendy. From what I have seen in addition to the tablet interface Windows 8 is really Windows 7 + Mac OS.

[Michael Slaunwhite]

To be fair a lot of the changes Microsoft has made have been based on what has made Mac so trendy. From what I have seen in addition to the tablet interface Windows 8 is really Windows 7 + Mac OS.

There is the beauty of the latest OS. They have taken the best, and the strongest of their arsenal (Windows 7 with all the tweaks, and fixes), added a whole new design which compliments the tablet, phone, and Xbox series and built shangri la. Microsoft is so successful because they cater to the masses, not to a small corner of constituents like Apple or Linux has done. To me MS is like Ford (in the past), Ford knew how to get his automobiles sold, and into the hands of the public, and Microsoft has done the exact same thing, and kept making it so accessible that Bill Gates saturated the market which kept them strong in the eyes of the community.

As you have mentioned that all companies use other companies ideas, and doing this has given the edge once again to MS. Apple I hope steps up, or they will get pounded again if they don't answer MS's move.

Personally what MS has done is brilliant (sad in some cases as you have clearly pointed out), but in the end will be the driving force behind what is going to come for the software industry, and change the way we do business, use the Internet, and have fun.

[RebBugler]

Question for Flanyboy

You seem to know your stuff here and not influenced by hype. So, what's your recommendation for sound desktop PC performance, MS OS7 or 8?
(not considering in the tablet or specialty small device crap which I have absolutely no need for)

Thanks, wish I could stick with XP, but I need more RAM...so gotta move to 64 bit.

[Michael Slaunwhite]

@Flanboy.

I have been doing some reading on the ARM architecture you have been so weary about, and it concerning Microsoft.

Here is a small list so far of Operating systems that are porting over to ARM architecture.

+ Debian
+ RedHat OpenJDK
+ MAC OS X

These are just three that popped out my first search. Hmmmm, I don't see many people jumping on the band wagon to discredit them for thinking about doing the same thing that MS is going to eventually do.

Now there is the issue you spoke of concerning the processing power, and I did read that lower stand-alone processor speed is low, but by coupling the Cortex-A15 Processor, and the Cortex-A7 processor, you get the best of both worlds (speed, and performance). Also check out Mali: http://arm.com/products/multimedia/mali ... /index.php for information about Video Graphics Hardware.

Here are the two articles concerning the about Cortex-A15, and the Cortex-A7 processors, and what this means. So far from what I have read concerning Windows OS, this won't happen for a few more years (the death of the PC, and Intel). Also Intel is now working on their answer too ARM (they are still off the mark in making it happen they have had a few flops, but they will make it happen).

#1: http://www.arm.com/products/processors/ ... ex-a15.php
#2: http://www.arm.com/products/processors/ ... tex-a7.php


Now as far as porting games to the new ARM Architecture I'm still trying to dig up info about it, and is it difficult. If history tells me anything believe me there are workarounds, and I am sure that some bright people out there will make it happen (porting games to work on ARM Systems).

Here is a pretty nice article to read, if you haven't done so already.

Apple intern spent 12 weeks porting Mac OS X to ARM: http://www.geek.com/articles/chips/appl ... m-2012027/

I'm sure you know all of this already. believe me in the long run we might be better off, but at this moment I can say this because I'm sitting comfortably in front of my PC that is just not going anywhere.

But we all know we can't stop the invention of technology. I still miss my Tandy 1000SL because I loved working with it, but that is the price of wanting to move forward. I know there will be people who can port over software, and PC games to the new Architecture because Gamers do not like being left behind.

In the end though, I am of the thought that nothing is impossible, and I don't get afraid of technology, and what it may mean to me as a gamer. Anything can be done, and when I hear people saying "It's impossible, it can't be done", I just shake my head, and those people are the ones that scare me because they are so closed minded.

Cheers!

[Jim]

The ARM CPUs are used in a variety of tablets. NSD will not be going to any tablets as they do not have the hardware to run the game. The MAC OS as polished as it is has never gotten over about 10% market share and Linux is much less than that. If these or any new OS gained a significant market share then we would consider whether the half a year or more that it would take to convert to a new OS and test it would be worth the additional sales we might get.

-Jim

[Michael Slaunwhite]

The ARM CPUs are used in a variety of tablets. NSD will not be going to any tablets as they do not have the hardware to run the game. The MAC OS as polished as it is has never gotten over about 10% market share and Linux is much less than that. If these or any new OS gained a significant market share then we would consider whether the half a year or more that it would take to convert to a new OS and test it would be worth the additional sales we might get.

-Jim

Absolutely, why even consider porting over to the ARM Architecture when there is no need to do so. This is why I'm not listening to scare mongering about where the PC is heading. I see the PC staying where it is for the next few years. The ARM Architecture is basically for the Tablet, and other devices, and not for the PC. Eventually the PC will catch up, but for now I seriously doubt that it will change over as quickly as people pushing the fear will lead you to believe.

The full reason why other OS's are considering to move to the ARM technology is to be able to have people install their OS on their tablets instead of Windows 8.

[Flanyboy]

Question for Flanyboy

You seem to know your stuff here and not influenced by hype. So, what's your recommendation for sound desktop PC performance, MS OS7 or 8?
(not considering in the tablet or specialty small device crap which I have absolutely no need for)

Thanks, wish I could stick with XP, but I need more RAM...so gotta move to 64 bit.

Reb

I would say Windows 7.

Keep in mind Microsoft tends to do a phenomenal job of supporting their operating systems for years after the fact, XP is just ending its support life time and that was released years and years ago. Windows 7 will be the dominate OS for awhile still.

Further Windows 8 is simply too new. I know the early reports for Windows 8 are that it's pretty stable but I personally would never buy an OS that is less than 6 months old. If your buying a PC or building one in the next 6 months I wouldn't go with anything but Windows 7 simply because its polished while Windows 8 is still too new.

When do you intend to upgrade? Is this a short term question or long term?

[RebBugler]

Question for Flanyboy

You seem to know your stuff here and not influenced by hype. So, what's your recommendation for sound desktop PC performance, MS OS7 or 8?
(not considering in the tablet or specialty small device crap which I have absolutely no need for)

Thanks, wish I could stick with XP, but I need more RAM...so gotta move to 64 bit.

Reb

I would say Windows 7.

Keep in mind Microsoft tends to do a phenomenal job of supporting their operating systems for years after the fact, XP is just ending its support life time and that was released years and years ago. Windows 7 will be the dominate OS for awhile still.

Further Windows 8 is simply too new. I know the early reports for Windows 8 are that it's pretty stable but I personally would never buy an OS that is less than 6 months old. If your buying a PC or building one in the next 6 months I wouldn't go with anything but Windows 7 simply because its polished while Windows 8 is still too new.

When do you intend to upgrade? Is this a short term question or long term?

Thanks a bunch, I kinda figured that from what you've stated and what I've read. This will be long term, I don't jump on every OS, obviously, since I passed up VISTA and 7, but the limited RAM thing is a definite issue. I put off as long as I could, because as I complained, I rebelled against the MS approach where with OS7 I have to ask permission to use MY COMPUTER. So, I'll suck it up, and learn how to give myself permission, AARRGG, gotta move to 64 bit, and deal with the MS paranoia that everyone's out to steal their stuff.
Just seems like a crime that we consumers must learn to deal with pirates afraid of piracy :woohoo: in order to have access to mainstream computer technology.