Screen shot/map question
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Screen shot/map question
In Norb's December 30th screen shots there is one showing the Cemetery Gatehouse and the famous 90 foot tall tree. The screenshot shows a house at the base of the tree and a couple houses adjacent to that house. Based on the Warren map and the 1863 photo taken from the roof of the Gatehouse it appears there weren't any buldings on the north side of Cemetery Hill for quite a distance until you got down near the wagon Hotel, the post war orphanage, and McClellan house area. Am I looking at this wrong?
Last edited by Amish John on Thu Jan 22, 2009 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
You can get farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone.
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Re:Screen shot/map question
Good find, and I'm sure someone from the Art team will be commenting on this.
It would probably help if they could see the Warren map and 1863 photo that you mentioned (also, I'm curious to see). Do you have a link to them by any chance?
It would probably help if they could see the Warren map and 1863 photo that you mentioned (also, I'm curious to see). Do you have a link to them by any chance?
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Re:Screen shot/map question
Little Powell wrote:
http://www.simmonsgames.com/tools/mapvi ... Frame.html
And here's the photo taken from the roof of the cemetery gatehouse right after the battle. The 90 ft tall (poplar?) tree is just in the right edge of the photo. Click on photo to enlarge.

And here is a link to the Evergreen Cemetery website which shows what they believe to be the color scheme of the gatehouse at the time of the battle. Note that the thin arch of bricks over the arched opening no longer exists on the present day gatehouse.
http://www.evergreencemetery.org/
Another screenshot in that same series shows the structure behind the gatehouse to be about as tall as the gatehouse itself. I know this is nit picking, but the structure should be reduced in scale to be about half the height of the gatehouse per the linked photo.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= ... n%26sa%3DN
Here's the link to the Warren map for all to enjoy and use to drive the NSD map maker crazy with endless questions.Good find, and I'm sure someone from the Art team will be commenting on this.
It would probably help if they could see the Warren map and 1863 photo that you mentioned (also, I'm curious to see). Do you have a link to them by any chance?
http://www.simmonsgames.com/tools/mapvi ... Frame.html
And here's the photo taken from the roof of the cemetery gatehouse right after the battle. The 90 ft tall (poplar?) tree is just in the right edge of the photo. Click on photo to enlarge.

And here is a link to the Evergreen Cemetery website which shows what they believe to be the color scheme of the gatehouse at the time of the battle. Note that the thin arch of bricks over the arched opening no longer exists on the present day gatehouse.
http://www.evergreencemetery.org/
Another screenshot in that same series shows the structure behind the gatehouse to be about as tall as the gatehouse itself. I know this is nit picking, but the structure should be reduced in scale to be about half the height of the gatehouse per the linked photo.
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= ... n%26sa%3DN
Last edited by Amish John on Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You can get farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone.
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Re:Screen shot/map question
Thanks for that Amish John. I'll let the map makers take it from here, don't want to step on any toes. 

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Re:Screen shot/map question
we are truly blessed to have such dedicated students of the area with the gift of detail; unfortunately there are several instances where reality has to make room for the mechanics of the game. Rest assured the actual game looks a bit different than the screenshots would have you believe.
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Re:Screen shot/map question
Louie Raider wrote:
Amish John - I'll just say; the first time you load up one of the maps, be prepared for your jaw to drop..
we are truly blessed to have such dedicated students of the area with the gift of detail
Amish John - I'll just say; the first time you load up one of the maps, be prepared for your jaw to drop..

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Re:Screen shot/map question
Amish John,
Thanks for the cool B) B) picture & links !!!!
Chamberlain
Thanks for the cool B) B) picture & links !!!!


Chamberlain
Last edited by Chamberlain on Fri Jan 23, 2009 6:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
-Col. Joshua Chamberlain, 20th Maine
We cannot retreat. We cannot withdraw. We are going to have to be stubborn today
We cannot retreat. We cannot withdraw. We are going to have to be stubborn today
Re:Screen shot/map question
Little Powell wrote:
I will second what LP said. They are amazing!!Louie Raider wrote:we are truly blessed to have such dedicated students of the area with the gift of detail
Amish John - I'll just say; the first time you load up one of the maps, be prepared for your jaw to drop..
"It is strange, to have a shell come so near you...you can feel the wind."
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Re:Screen shot/map question
estabu2 wrote:
That the maps will be jaw-dropping, I have no doubt. The NSD team seems a dedicated, detail oriented bunch. I'm sure any comments any of us send your way are only meant to be constructive and meant to head off critcizisms once the game is released. Better to be aware of issues now and have a chance to address them now rather than have reviewers and customers bring them up later. Looking forward to more screenshots and videos.Little Powell wrote:I will second what LP said. They are amazing!!Louie Raider wrote:we are truly blessed to have such dedicated students of the area with the gift of detail
Amish John - I'll just say; the first time you load up one of the maps, be prepared for your jaw to drop..
You can get farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a kind word alone.
Re:Screen shot/map question
I've gone back and had a careful look at the area in question. The apparent height of the gazebo is an illusion of the angle of the shot combined with the different heights of the ground each item is standing on.
The other issue is more complex. The post-battle photo is angled to the northeast so that the building in question was out of frame to the left. That building is on the Warren map, but you also need to remember that buildings are oversized to match the soldier sprites. We could have scaled everything to exact photographic precision, but then the regiments would only have covered 25% of their historical frontage. We decided to 'adjust' things in several areas to get a reasonable balance among historical appearance, accurate simulation of the battle, and game performance on systems folks can actually afford to buy. In about another 5 years or so, my guess is that the PC performance will be good enough to simulate major battles at 1:1. For now, we have to accept compromises.
-Jim
The other issue is more complex. The post-battle photo is angled to the northeast so that the building in question was out of frame to the left. That building is on the Warren map, but you also need to remember that buildings are oversized to match the soldier sprites. We could have scaled everything to exact photographic precision, but then the regiments would only have covered 25% of their historical frontage. We decided to 'adjust' things in several areas to get a reasonable balance among historical appearance, accurate simulation of the battle, and game performance on systems folks can actually afford to buy. In about another 5 years or so, my guess is that the PC performance will be good enough to simulate major battles at 1:1. For now, we have to accept compromises.
-Jim
"My God, if we've not got a cool brain and a big one too, to manage this affair, the nation is ruined forever." Unknown private, 14th Vermont, 2 July 1863