I am having some trouble with this.

[Skyhigh]

This WL04.
Basically the only thing I did was to send Passage's division forward to LHS, I have sent Donzelot forward to the enemy line via Command Map, and gave a Line Wide stance.

Then I just sit back and watch, and I see this appearing.
So the enemy comes forward, which is fine for me. But I see these guys dancing in a circle... And look at the formations at the bottom of the picture. 2 lines running diagonally, and a line running horizontally through them.

Why are the diagonal lines like this? They are presenting the flanks to the North, where the enemy is. The enemy line next to the circle is facing West right now, whilst the threat is clearly coming from south and east.

Now I have played battles like this, I have enjoyed them before but now my imagination has run to a limit here. It just looks stupid, basically.

And again, I just gave out 2 orders here eh. Nothing more. So it can't be my style of playing that causes this. I ran the latest Grog Toolbar version and Realsmoke, that's the only mods. Is there anything else I can do to get this better?

The attachment screen0011.jpg is no longer available

[RebBugler]

Yeah, hard to defend that look - this screenshot is reflecting units moving in WIDE lines with WIDE pathing windows. With the Grog Toolbar I'm trying to remedy these disorganized 'looks'. Coming with the next update (3.1) ALL 'Line' movements will default to Column by Division. This enables the AI to direct units more precisely by following narrower pathing routes. By my testing this has improved AI sanity already.

Also, behind the scenes, we're testing and trying new AI sequences on a daily basis to help improve the SOW experience.

[Volunteer]

Good to hear this RebBugler!

[con20or]

What sprite ratio do you play at?

[Little Powell]

Yeah this is an inherent issue with the huge battalions that we aren't used to from SOWGB. They are so much bigger in Napoleonics, that we had to increase the default sprite ratio.

It's about finding the happy medium between showing as many troops as possible, while keeping the troop lines in good order.

[mitra76]

Some explication of how the AI manage the brigade is necessary I think (consider is logic already present in GB, it worked well there was not reason to change it, what changed in WL is the dimension of all, brigades, battalions, batteries) in order to understand anomalies like this one:

1 - Stance: Also if the names of stances (hold to the last,all out attack, attack) can create confusion about their roles, the first and more important role of stance for the brigades AI is the decision about the distance and the force rapport with the enemey to which the AI reacts:

- at example for the infantry the Hold to the last stance tell to the brigade to react (stops and forms the combat formation) to the enemy at musket range and move to engage if the enemy if essentialy less stronger than us. All out attack engage the nearest enemy inside a range variable between the more the 300-800 yards also if 4 times stronger than the brigades. Alol the other stances works with different values inside these ranges, but the logic is this one. This is the primary role of brigade stance, there're regiment reactions depending from them, but for the player is important consider the primary role when organize a brigade attack.

so resuming in order to control well a brigade attack, the best is move in hold to the last, possibly already in fight formation, near the front (300 yards) we want attack and after switch to another stance according to the effort we want the brigade apply against the enemy around. If the all out attack is applied too soon, is easy that the brigade decide to attack a enemy nearest also if out of his destination path.

- another description is about what the units do when the brigade is already in fight. The brigade AI try always to "found of place" to fight for all the not engaged battalions around ideal deployment places respect the contact area the officer (flanks, in line, forward). There're checks for avoid contacts a priori but ground sometime limits the range of early watch of friends and this generates sometimes contacts especially if the path calculation select a long path for reach the destination given, passing near other brigades paths. Is clear from this that have a good space between a brigade and another is the best for avoid contacts and engage more troops possible at the same time.

Place more checks blocks is a complicate thing, which requires many tests we're doing with the testers (in addition to other things), to exagerate means immobilisme.

[Marching Thru Georgia]

It is true that players need to be aware of proper spacing for their brigades and divisions but that is also true for the AI. The AI has no concept of this fact.

Until divisions and brigade have exclusive zones of operation that other brigades and divisions must avoid, the pictures like the one above will always be displayed and criticized. The sort of thing the KS mod does and now RebBugler's, is just a cosmetic attempt to correct a basic flaw in the game. This is a problem that exists in all NSD games and one that should receive appropriate attention. NSD needs to stop trying to paper over this problem and spend the time and effort needed to fix it. Otherwise the criticisms that have plagued this game are going to continue. The situation benefits no one.

[essdee]

I do not have the game and, to be honest, do not feel able to purchase at the moment due to these problems. Watching replays from YouTube tend to find myself concentrating, negatively, with these ridiculous formations instead of following the battle.

Perhaps if I had a demo in which to immerse myself I would "forget" them in the excitement of my battle/orders.

Histwar go about ordering formations by drawing a line that specifies actual width.

I do so hope that the problem can be overcome.

Regards to all the developers.

[Saddletank]

I agree with MTG. In almost all periods of military conflict, friendly formations avoided each other for very simple reasons. In Napoleon's time a corps would be allocated a frontage of battlefield and no other corps would operate within the boundaries defined by that area. The same control over the lower level formations applied with divisions, brigades and battalions being allocated 'lanes' or areas of advance or frontages of defence that would not be violated by other commands.

SoW needs to define "zones of operation" or "zones of exclusivity" for all AI formations, and indeed should absolutely prohibit player-controlled formations from doing the same thing.

In addition I would very much like to see the AI morale system overhauled with battalions/squadrons, brigades/batteries, divisions, corps and armies each given an "exhaustion level" which, when reached, renders that unit/formation incapable of further offensive action. They could defend, or move slowly within a defended area but could no longer attack. Their firing and melee capability would be significantly reduced. They would still offer support to other friends. The AI can easily count its losses and which units have surrendered or routed and a battalion/squadron ought to start checking for exhaustion at about 10% losses and would automatically fail at 50%, and higher level formations could do so at similar % ages of losses, counted in terms of sub-units, so that a 6 battalion brigade would be "exhausted" after 3 of it's battalions were "exhausted". A division would count it's brigades a corps its divisions and so on.

This would make our battles more Napoleonic in feel and concept and less like Total War where you had to hunt down every last surviving enemy - the end game of SoW battles feels awkwardly like this sometimes.

[Skyhigh]

What sprite ratio do you play at?

I think this was at 1:2.
1:4 is default right? I will try the same with that tomorrow.