Day 1 /Gettysburg

[Hancock the Superb]

I was thinking of Hancock's corps.

Of course I arrived on the battlefield and rectified the position! :laugh:

Mr. Odox:

I believe that Lane's brigade did form squares - but that was during Pender's attack! This wasn't at the start of the battle on the 1st day (towards the end, actually). I am unsure as to whether Perrin did form squares or not, I would guess not, because he didn't really engage the cavalry that much - he was more against Biddle's brigade, supported by cavalry. I guess he could have formed squares, but my sorces say he didn't.

[Kerflumoxed]

Hancock the Superb wrote:

I was thinking of Hancock's corps.

Of course I arrived on the battlefield and rectified the position! :laugh:

Mr. Odox:

I believe that Lane's brigade did form squares - but that was during Pender's attack! This wasn't at the start of the battle on the 1st day (towards the end, actually). I am unsure as to whether Perrin did form squares or not, I would guess not, because he didn't really engage the cavalry that much - he was more against Biddle's brigade, supported by cavalry. I guess he could have formed squares, but my sorces say he didn't.

Since I am far from a GB expert, I cannot dispute the forming of "squares" by the Confederate infantry during GB. However, I can state with some certainty that a "square" is purely a defensive manuver to halt a mounted cavalry attack upon the infantry. It is impossible to launch an infantry attack from that manuver without reordering the command into a line or column. Since a "square" was a rarely used, at least during the CW, documentation would be most helpful as well as documentation that the Federal cavalry launched a mounted attack against the Confederate infantry.

As I read the 1995 Gary Kross article so kindly noted, I fail to see any evidence supporting that author's claim of the Confederates forming a "square." Rather, he is operating in the realm of speculation: "Whether it happened or not, I believed something was in front of Wayne that slowed them up and until someone can tell me otherwise, who or what slowed up Wayne's brigade, why Wayne's brigade did not give any support at all to Parins' brigade that was attacking the Union Infantry at the Seminary itself. Then I'm going to still believe that the Union Cavalry forced Wayne's brigade to stop and reform - to form against a mounted cavalry charge. Where that took place I believe is west of the seminary on the south side of the Fairfield-Haggerstown Road." It is difficult to believe that this actually occurred without any other supporting evidence then a simple "belief."

J

[Armchair General]

Square formations were obsolete by the Civil War. They were essentially hedgerows of bayonets for when smoothbore muskets couldn't be relied on to take down enough troopers to halt the charge. No horse would ever run into a bayonet purposefully, so they worked wonders. By the time of the Civil War however, as you all know, the rifle had come around. Squares were not needed because an infantry battalion in line could easily stop a cavalry attack before they even got close. Need examples?

1) Cavalry charge at the end of the Battle of Gaines' Mill. They were routed with one volley.
2)Cavalry charge at the closing stages of Cedar Mountain. Also routed.
3) The disastrous attack of a cavalry squadron at the Battle of Chancellorsville. Routed.

[Hancock the Superb]

My sources indicate Lane's troops formed squares, due to their commanders timidy. Lane was ordered to attack, saw the cavalry, halted, and formed squares. His command barely fired a shot.

[Kerflumoxed]

Hancock the Superb wrote:

My sources indicate Lane's troops formed squares, due to their commanders timidy. Lane was ordered to attack, saw the cavalry, halted, and formed squares. His command barely fired a shot.

Very interesting! Would like to know the primary source of this data.

As an aside, it was possible to break the "square" by the cavalry attacking a corner where the square was its weakest. Cavalry would attack by a column of fours with each successive "four" breaking to the left and right by twos. Once the corner caved in, the column would continue into the square and break it up from within.

J

[O. O. Howard]

Kerflumoxed wrote:

Hancock the Superb wrote:

My sources indicate Lane's troops formed squares, due to their commanders timidy. Lane was ordered to attack, saw the cavalry, halted, and formed squares. His command barely fired a shot.

Very interesting! Would like to know the primary source of this data.

As an aside, it was possible to break the "square" by the cavalry attacking a corner where the square was its weakest. Cavalry would attack by a column of fours with each successive "four" breaking to the left and right by twos. Once the corner caved in, the column would continue into the square and break it up from within.

J

I guess you just wouldn't want to be one of the first four guys in the column of fours that is breaking the square!

[Hancock the Superb]

The main one: Gettysburg, A Testing of Courage, by Noah Trudeau (I think that's how you spell his last name).

[Kerflumoxed]

O. O. Howard wrote:

Kerflumoxed wrote:

Hancock the Superb wrote:

My sources indicate Lane's troops formed squares, due to their commanders timidy. Lane was ordered to attack, saw the cavalry, halted, and formed squares. His command barely fired a shot.

Very interesting! Would like to know the primary source of this data.

As an aside, it was possible to break the "square" by the cavalry attacking a corner where the square was its weakest. Cavalry would attack by a column of fours with each successive "four" breaking to the left and right by twos. Once the corner caved in, the column would continue into the square and break it up from within.

J

I guess you just wouldn't want to be one of the first four guys in the column of fours that is breaking the square!

That would probably qualify as hazardous duty! However, with the advent of the "six-shooter" I suspect that became the weapon of choice for the attack...and would enable your to avoid contacting the fixed bayonets!

J :woohoo:

[Kerflumoxed]

Hancock the Superb wrote:

The main one: Gettysburg, A Testing of Courage, by Noah Trudeau (I think that's how you spell his last name).

Thanks, General Hancock! Haven't read that one so will have to find it in the library.

BTW, where did Hancock received the sobriquet, "The Superb?"

J

[Armchair General]

Kerflumoxed wrote:

Hancock the Superb wrote:

The main one: Gettysburg, A Testing of Courage, by Noah Trudeau (I think that's how you spell his last name).

Thanks, General Hancock! Haven't read that one so will have to find it in the library.

BTW, where did Hancock received the sobriquet, "The Superb?"

J

He got it at Williamsburg, (May 5, 1862). In a dispatch to D.C. McClellan said, "And Hancock fought superbly."